Do not pass "Go". Do not collect $200 or anything for that matter. Sadly, Partisanship rules the day again.

[bodyforlife]

So the Senate has gone home for the weekend without a solution to the unemployment problem.

The Democrats had an opportunity to have the additional $600 benefit extended for a week but they refused using people as pawns in their little Chess game. On the other side of the coin are Republicans and their constituents that can't seem to figure out basic math and are insisting the Democrats accept a plan that is essentially a gift to them. The plan is being cheered on by brain dead posters that are so caught up in the Red Team/Blue Team nonsense, that they can't see the forest for the trees.

So the Democrats want the original plan which was based on the average wage in the United States (approximately $25/hour or $1000/week). Unemployment pays typically 40% ($400/week) and the additional $600 gets people to $1000/week or 100% of their average wage.

Republicans want 70% replacement wage, topping out at no more than $500 per week additional benefit.

So let's do a comparison:

Average wage in high cost-of-living areas (typically Democratic strongholds).

New York - $38.77
Mass - $36.75
California - $36.25
Connect - $35.77
Wash - $35.58

Average wage in lower cost-of-living areas (typically Republican strongholds)

Miss -$21.29
Montana -$22.32
Arkansas -$23.16
Idaho -$23.92
South D -$23.96


So let's take an average of $36 Democratic and $23 Republican

Unemployed Democrat

Old Rate: $576 (40% of average) + $600 Add'l benefit = $1176

New Rate: $36 x 40 = 1440 week
70% of 1440 = $1008

Difference: 1176-1008 = 168 (14% reduction)

Unemployed Republican

Old Rate: $368 (40% of average) + $600 Add'l benefit = $968

New Rate: $23 x 40 = 920 per week
70% of 920 = $644

Difference: 968-644 =324 (33% reduction)


Unemployed Democrats yells "Please don't take away 14% of my average wage". Unemployed Republican says "Screw you Democrats! I want my average wage reduced by 33%".


Yep, you just can't make this shit up. And of course, the Republicans will give away some more in other things to makes sure they can get their way on the 70% gift to the Democrats.

Simply Brilliant!

 

[Willie99]

I appreciate what you're trying to do, but there are so many more variables in play. To begin with, the most obvious, it's not always about "me".

The average wage thing has so many variables in play, I couldn't possible address everything nor do I have the will to.

You're 100% accurate about do nothing career politicians playing games, its' what they do best.

 

[Legend-I-Aint]

a deal will get done

 

[TomGshotput]

You make a lot of good points. The government does not do things to help the people, they do things that hurt the people. The Democrats are especially bad, as they are all communists. Taking money from people who work and giving it to people who are too lazy to work is a great example of the communism that the Democrats use to hurt America and the American people.

 

[Willie99]

a deal will get done

Yes, but in the meantime we get the hear how bad wepwicans are

Which is the same narrative regardless of the circumstances, regardless who's President or Speaker or who controls the Senate, regardless of the issues, regardless of who's holding it up..... It's always always always always always always always... into infinity and beyond, the fault of the wepuwicans, without exemption

That alone should "woke" a few eyes, but one can't see when they're blinded for life

 

[bodyforlife]

I appreciate what you're trying to do, but there are so many more variables in play. To begin with, the most obvious, it's not always about "me".

The average wage thing has so many variables in play, I couldn't possible address everything nor do I have the will to.

You're 100% accurate about do nothing career politicians playing games, its' what they do best.

The numbers are the numbers Willie. We can both go to the Bureau of Labor Statistics and check figures on average wage and it will come out exactly as I stated, as will the math I laid out. And it's not like this pandemic has only impacted one side or the other. I know registered Republicans and Democrats that are out of jobs right now (I'm sure you do also). When people are having problems paying a mortgage or putting food on the table, it absolutely does become about that person and their family. And the majority lost their jobs by no fault of their own. There are people like you that do everything they can to help out a friend and assist them in finding new employment. And then, there are those that really don't give a shit. That will chant stupid talking points about how so many people make more without even understanding how the numbers were tabulated. They don't realize that in addition to people that have been furloughed and lost their income, that they also have to pay some other benefits they lost (health care being a big one). Maybe they had a matching 401k and child care. Of course they lose out on future SS wages by not working. Those same people also make it seem like it should be no problem for people to just get back to work, even though many had career jobs and made more than that $25 hour average (and those jobs aren't readily available now...and may never be depending on what they were doing). Let alone, people can't just reinvent themselves in such a short period of time (it might actually involve going back to school and learning a new trade/profession). Obviously there's the other side of the coin with the potential for significant inflation in the future, so this can be a pick your poison scenario.

Ultimately what I'm trying to do Willie is to get people to use some critical thinking skills and stop getting so caught up in the Red Team/Blue Team bullshit. Understand what's really going on here and how it impacts people. And of course, try to have some empathy instead of regurgitating talking points. Despite the bravado I see on-line about how everyone has this big nest egg and shouldn't have to rely on assistance, how many people do you really think could last on 40% of their income for an extended period of time? Some of these guys talk about this like they do with all that monopoly money they use to bet on games, with these amazing bankrolls that you see touted on this site (and most of us know it's pure nonsense).

 

[Willie99]

The solution is not ever increasing government programs, that always increases dependency, the solution is to start growing the economy again

Without opening the economy, we create something far worse than the Great Depression

"A rising tide raises all boats", it's takes a strong economy for our society to survive




As for the numbers being the numbers, in Connecticut for example, we have the biggest disparity between the haves and the have nots. How does this happen? Because we have a crazy stupid tax burden which increases the cost of living for the working class and provides very generous social programs which in turn increases the number of people willing to live on social assistance. Why do those people need more?

I know first hand there's a need out there, people are hurting. I also know first hand many people, maybe even the majority, are benefiting from a financial windfall like never before.

So no, the numbers don't tell the whole story, the nuances of the truth run far deeper. And there is NO simple, blanket solution, I can't pretend there is.

But career politicians love those games, hence I totally concur with political bullshit statements

 

[bodyforlife]

The solution is not ever increasing government programs, that always increases dependency, the solution is to start growing the economy again

Without opening the economy, we create something far worse than the Great Depression

"A rising tide raises all boats", it's takes a strong economy for our society to survive




As for the numbers being the numbers, in Connecticut for example, we have the biggest disparity between the haves and the have nots. How does this happen? Because we have a crazy stupid tax burden which increases the cost of living for the working class and provides very generous social programs which in turn increases the number of people willing to live on social assistance. Why do those people need more?

I know first hand there's a need out there, people are hurting. I also know first hand many people, maybe even the majority, are benefiting from a financial windfall like never before.

So no, the numbers don't tell the whole story, the nuances of the truth run far deeper. And there is NO simple, blanket solution, I can't pretend there is.

But career politicians love those games, hence I totally concur with political bullshit statements

Ok, so what do you do in the meantime for people like your friend or my boss, who really don't have any control over their situations and have been hard working citizens all their lives. Me and my co-workers did what we could with a GoFundMe. I'm sure you're doing everything for your friend. Do we just tell them to make sure you vote for someone that doesn't support big government and good luck to you in the meantime?

 

[TomGshotput]

Ok, so what do you do in the meantime for people like your friend or my boss, who really don't have any control over their situations and have been hard working citizens all their lives. Me and my co-workers did what we could with a GoFundMe. I'm sure you're doing everything for your friend. Do we just tell them to make sure you vote for someone that doesn't support big government and good luck to you in the meantime?

These are really great questions. One thing we can do is remember that we do have control over our situations. Anyone who wants to can go and find a business and do work that helps that business increase their profits, then that business pays them. The amount that business pays is determined by how hard that person works to increase profits. We can all advise anyone to do that. We can also go another step and start our own businesses and pay people who help us increase our profits.

 

[brendanjack]

These are really great questions. One thing we can do is remember that we do have control over our situations. Anyone who wants to can go and find a business and do work that helps that business increase their profits, then that business pays them. The amount that business pays is determined by how hard that person works to increase profits. We can all advise anyone to do that. We can also go another step and start our own businesses and pay people who help us increase our profits.

That’s like a textbook answer however most people don’t have the capital to start there own business. Getting licenses and permits takes time as well as different types of insurances from liability to workman’s comp then factor in corona virus. Good luck dealing with any local department . There are plenty of jobs out there and maybe our country should focus more on trade skills then wasting time and money on costly degrees with zero return.

 

[bodyforlife]

That’s like a textbook answer however most people don’t have the capital to start there own business. Getting licenses and permits takes time as well as different types of insurances from liability to workman’s comp then factor in corona virus. Good luck dealing with any local department . There are plenty of jobs out there and maybe our country should focus more on trade skills then wasting time and money on costly degrees with zero return.

Don't get caught up with his shtick. He's always good for some ambiguous, text book answer in his alternate universe. I don't even waste time responding to him.

I have always been a big fan of trade skills and think that's much better than many degrees offered by colleges that don't net out much for students but leave them with enough in student loan debt to pay a small mortgage. Obviously, these things take time. Better than 4 years in college, but typically at least a year. And people on unemployment right now are going to need some time (this was a curve ball many did not anticipate and took most by surprise).

 

[TomGshotput]

That’s like a textbook answer however most people don’t have the capital to start there own business. Getting licenses and permits takes time as well as different types of insurances from liability to workman’s comp then factor in corona virus. Good luck dealing with any local department . There are plenty of jobs out there and maybe our country should focus more on trade skills then wasting time and money on costly degrees with zero return.

You make a lot of great points. Some people may lack the ability to overcome the barriers to start their own business. They may be benefit for working for another business that someone else started. That option is always available to anyone willing to work hard. That's not based on textbooks, that's based on the real world.

 

[TomGshotput]

I have always been a big fan of trade skills and think that's much better than many degrees offered by colleges that don't net out much for students but leave them with enough in student loan debt to pay a small mortgage. Obviously, these things take time. Better than 4 years in college, but typically at least a year. And people on unemployment right now are going to need some time (this was a curve ball many did not anticipate and took most by surprise).

This is a great point. Having a trade skill without debt is often a lot better than having a degree with debt. This shows that we do have a lot of control over our lives.

 

[Willie99]

Ok, so what do you do in the meantime for people like your friend or my boss, who really don't have any control over their situations and have been hard working citizens all their lives. Me and my co-workers did what we could with a GoFundMe. I'm sure you're doing everything for your friend. Do we just tell them to make sure you vote for someone that doesn't support big government and good luck to you in the meantime?

My friend knows why he lost his job, I'm guessing your friend does too. I think they'll vote accordingly

Whatever relief bills comes, it should be directed to help the people that have been hurt, that's my argument. Politicians in DC should act like adults and arrive at real solutions, but they won't, especially during an election year. They'll opt for another quick fix and try to buy as many votes as possible

 

[FairWarning]

A lot of people in my area were making more by not working. Grunts making $16-18 at the local casino were making $965/week with the added $600. A lot of essential workers were not making close to that, plus they were facing all of the risk.

 

[Michelangelo]

This clusterfk is what happens when politicians overreach and try to micromanage the free market system. It is not the coronavirus but the politicians who are strangling the society as we knew it only 5 short months ago.

The coronavirus is not the threat. The politicians who have responded to it are.

 

[bodyforlife]

My friend knows why he lost his job, I'm guessing your friend does too. I think they'll vote accordingly

Whatever relief bills comes, it should be directed to help the people that have been hurt, that's my argument. Politicians in DC should act like adults and arrive at real solutions, but they won't, especially during an election year. They'll opt for another quick fix and try to buy as many votes as possible

This clusterfk is what happens when politicians overreach and try to micromanage the free market system. It is not the coronavirus but the politicians who are strangling the society as we knew it only 5 short months ago.

The coronavirus is not the threat. The politicians who have responded to it are.

No doubt the problem is the politicians. And I would say it's across the board (both parties and the President). It should be no surprise to anyone that some would make more in this process. That's how an average works (some are higher and some are lower). But to only focus on the ones making more is wrong also. I'm not a fan of throwing out the baby with the bath water just because part of a system is broken. If it's broken then fix it. But the 1/3 that do need the aid shouldn't be penalized.

And yes, I'm all for a means tested benefit system so the funds are allocated appropriately. The problem is the computer system is antiquated. It uses a language that was around when I was a kid (cobol) and you need a specialist to run it. Switching out computers for the entire nation is a daunting task, but one that should have been taken on quite some time ago. Four months have elapsed and neither party or the President has done anything about this. So in fairness, let's stop taking sides here and realize that blame can be assessed across the board.